39 replies to this topic

[timmy850]

I bought some of the green stuff pads as I found a new unused pair for a good deal. I ended up having horrible fade on a medium length down hill section, so much so I nearly couldn’t stop and they got really smelly

The next time I drive the car they were totally fine and I haven’t had any problems since. That said I drive pretty calmly on the street

[gazza82]

Some pads need a specific bedding in process .. perhaps over-heating them was actually the correct thing to do.

I know I fitted Ferodo Performance pads to an Alfa 156 and I had to perform some drastic braking moves to bed them in or condition them. Not something you can usually do on the public roads so I had to find a quiet country lane. Even then I had to "compromise" a bit on the instructions as I had a limited length before the lane became a footpath!!

[Cooperman]

I used to be necessary to 'fade-in' new performance pads. To do this we used to drive along in 3rd gear at around 50 mph, apply full throttle and use the left foot on the brake to prevent the car from accelerating until the brakes faded. Then allow them to cool and repeat the process a second time. After that the brakes would be fine. This applied to the old Ferodo DS11 race/rally pads which were copper/asbestos. I do the same with Mintex race pads, but have not found it necessary with the Carbon-Metallic ones.

[growlerbearnz]

Most non-ceramic fast road/track/race pads need to be bedded in properly to get them past the "green fade" period. Green Fade is brake fade caused by the post-manufacture volatiles burning out and the friction compound settling into its final shape.

It's a one-time thing, and will only happen the first time the pads get good and hot. Bedding in involves getting the pads hot on purpose, while applying braking pressure to settle the compound. Lightly dragging the brakes until they smoke will get you past the green fade, but leaves the pads slightly spongier than they could be. 

It's entirely possible to drive gently enough that you never experience green fade, but if that's the case then you've wasted your money buying expensive pads. 

AP Racing bed-in procedure here: https://apracing.com...ng-in-procedure

 

 

I like Pagid RS44 pads on my 1275GT 7.5" brakes. They're track/race pads and so are a little feeble when stone cold (IE first brake application of the day) but excellent when even mildly warm, even during street/town driving. Good bite and linear response which makes modulation easy even under heavy braking. Impossible to fade on a Mini: they're good up to 700C (dark cherry red). Can squeal a little at low speed. 

Edited by growlerbearnz, 23 August 2023 - 02:37 AM.

[unburntfuelinthemorning]

Most non-ceramic fast road/track/race pads need to be bedded in properly to get them past the "green fade" period. Green Fade is brake fade caused by the post-manufacture volatiles burning out, and the compound settling into its final shape. You need to get the pads good and hot, but also apply braking pressure to settle the compound. Just dragging the brakes until they smoke isn't enough. 

 

Maybe I accidentally bedded in my brakes properly then.  It involved standing on the brakes at 80 down to about 50.  Drove back to mates five minutes away with brakes hardly working.  A few hours later when I left his they worked fine and have done ever since.  Not really a user friendly way of bedding in brakes for road use though.

[stuart bowes]

That's probably why they say not for road use I guess

In a road car which let's be honest isn't supposed to be driven in a spirited fashion, that first time you go to use them at speed to try and stop quickly you get nothing out of them

Obviously on a track car you expect these things and that's why don't try anything daft on the out lap but then after a few bends everything's hot for the rest of the race

[growlerbearnz]

standing on the brakes at 80 down to about 50.  Drove back to mates five minutes away with brakes hardly working.  A few hours later when I left his they worked fine and have done ever since.  

 

That'll do it! Though if you kept at it (3-4 hard stops) you would have found the brakes started to work again, even though they were hot. The smoke can be a little alarming though. 

[unburntfuelinthemorning]

That's probably why they say not for road use I guess

In a road car which let's be honest isn't supposed to be driven in a spirited fashion, that first time you go to use them at speed to try and stop quickly you get nothing out of them

Obviously on a track car you expect these things and that's why don't try anything daft on the out lap but then after a few bends everything's hot for the rest of the race

The pads I'm talking about are the road use pads -  EBC Ultimax Street as supplied with Minispares disc brake conversion kits.  

[maccers]

Thanks all, some really useful info. Yes bedding in can be different, I used to track day a very modified impreza and the pad bedding in process was advised to use track only! 

 

Back to the mini... the mintex pads are fine, straight out the box, a hundred times better. Only thing is they squeal a bit at very low, hardly touching the pedal type braking. They did'nt come with shims, I put a small dab of copper slip on them. I read somewhere about putting a slight edge on the pad, I dont know if thats the actual pad material or the metal the material is bonded to. 

 

Only other thing is the split pins to hold them in are stupidly long, I mean a good 1.5" too long. They fit the hole in the caliper though fine. Maybe I was using incorrect ones previously.

 

Will see how they get on in the last few weeks of summer. Done about 100 miles on em now.

[Steam]

Not sure but I seem to remember a specific procedure for ebc pads. The last set I fitted I again seem to remember going through a specific routine as recommended by ebc and I never had a problem. That being said they were no better than the mintex which were in before, make of that what you will.

[ac427]

EBC get a slagging on other car forums too. 

 

Just get the carbon metallic ones from Minispares.

[Cooperman]

EBC get a slagging on other car forums too.

Just get the carbon metallic ones from Minispares.

Yes.

[I hate Brian]

I can vouch for Cooperman's advice and bought the carbon pads you can tell the difference, THEY WORK!

[Cooperman]

I know the C-M pads are not low-cost, but they work at all temperatures from cold to, literally, red hot. They are even better than the legendary Copper-Asbestos DS11's which are, of course, no longer made.

If intending on using C-M's to the ultimate you do need competition brake fluid asn the pads are so good that DOT4 fluid will actually boil before the pads sjow any sign of fade.

They do last well too, which further justifies the higher price.

[Littlefella]

Do they do the carbon metallic pads for the 8.4" brakes on the Cooper Sport?