17 replies to this topic

[stellis]

ello, me agen, bout an engine swap, i was wondering could you fit a 1275 spi in , and would it be a nearly straight forward swap?, also, my mate has a spi and he told me that if you swap the throttle bodys to bigger ones, eg: a rover 114 throttle body teh ecu will recalerbrate to this to allow to achive more power out of the engine , is this true ?, wb ste

p.s. i did try a search to find out about the throttle body tnhgn, but cuddent find it, porb me not lookin properly, but cheers for anyhelp, thnks

[miniboo]

i think you are right about the throttle body yes

[Major Burkenshaw]

Unless your old engine/Gbox is an auto and your fitting a manual Gbox, then it should slip straight in. There is a lot more wiring for the injection engines, so you'll need to get the loom with the engine.

Not sure if the throttle body from the rover 100's will work, but fitting a large diameter unit can give up to 10bhp.

[Bungle]

if your thinking about tuning a injection mini then i would say go and have a read of mini sprockets projects pages

[Tarks]

The ecu wont recalerbrate to allow more power, all the ecu will do is recognise the throttle opening position
(you still may have to loosen the position sensor on the body to get it where the ecu likes it)

The fueling could poss be rich without having ecu plugged in to see what the fueling and air mixture is,
As the ecu allows only simple fuel/air changes and little else i would place an upgraded airfilter into your equation and this may possibly balance out the upgrade on the throttle body.

but id run it and check plug burn colour for a rough idea then get it plugged in and set up for about 45quid at rover its not wallet breaking cash.

and a very wise move.

Tarks.

(one off babybekks mpi coopers have already had this done and set-up by myself, its an easy install with a few nuts to undo and to gain full throttle opening a new cable position had to be made in the spring loaded throttle body opening cam). its does make a noticable differance when fitted correctly.

Edited by Tarks, 07 January 2007 - 04:09 PM.

[stellis]

The ecu wont recalerbrate to allow more power, all the ecu will do is recognise the throttle opening position
(you still may have to loosen the position sensor on the body to get it where the ecu likes it)

The fueling could poss be rich without having ecu plugged in to see what the fueling and air mixture is,
As the ecu allows only simple fuel/air changes and little else i would place an upgraded airfilter into your equation and this may possibly balance out the upgrade on the throttle body.

but id run it and check plug burn colour for a rough idea then get it plugged in and set up for about 45quid at rover its not wallet breaking cash.

and a very wise move.

Tarks.

cheersd for all the replys, i will have to try it jus to see hw its goes, i keep postin topics bout diff engines to ry and tiunin them,jus to see which would be best for my engine swap, , im lookin for about 100bhp achived, i am looking for an injection engine just becuase it will use less fuel wen pootling around , not really bother =d bout consumption wen thrappin it lol, cheers for the help, ste

[Sprocket]

The only way to get a bigger throttle body for the SPi is to modify one. This entails boring the body out to accept a HIF44 throttle disc. Its not really as straight forward as that as these thing go.

The 114SPi is exactly the same size throttle body, its the injector thats bigger. Increasing the size of the throttle body wont release any more horsepower unless you have increased the engines Volumetric Efficiency, baisicaly that means big cams modified heads and so on.

Modify one yourself for around £60, or buy one already done for around £300

I did this and to be honest its was a pain in the arse. The reason i did this, my engine is a Group A 1400.

There is one for sale by Vmax Scart on ebay now, finishing some time today, though i dont believe the 10bhp increase he claims.

As for the ecu, it is an adaptive system, that means it learns, it alters the base fuel map to compensate for these mods. The standard ecu is good for around 90 bhp. The fueling is not the problem, its the ignition, this is a fixed map and depending how far you go with the tuning mods will need adjusting, which as most know can only be done with a Superchips Icon pigy back ECU at £300. Not worth it TBVH.

The main reason the the magical 90bhp is difficult to break is because the ECU fueling uses Flow/density measuring of the air, which wild cams dont like.

Do the mods and the ECU will keep up but wont be perfect. Thats the bottom line.

Edited by Mini Sprocket, 07 January 2007 - 04:42 PM.

[Major Burkenshaw]

Didn't one of the mini mags fit an off the shelf larger throttle body on there tech pages? Think they wern't that impressed, think the only noticable difference was the throttle responce.

[Sprocket]

MPi off the shelf

SPi DIY

[Major Burkenshaw]

I've got the feeling Mini Sprocket, that your going to be my new best friend in the week i do my Spi conversion

[Sprocket]

..

[stellis]

The only way to get a bigger throttle body for the SPi is to modify one. This entails boring the body out to accept a HIF44 throttle disc. Its not really as straight forward as that as these thing go.

The 114SPi is exactly the same size throttle body, its the injector thats bigger. Increasing the size of the throttle body wont release any more horsepower unless you have increased the engines Volumetric Efficiency, baisicaly that means big cams modified heads and so on.

Modify one yourself for around £60, or buy one already done for around £300

I did this and to be honest its was a pain in the arse. The reason i did this, my engine is a Group A 1400.

There is one for sale by Vmax Scart on ebay now, finishing some time today, though i dont believe the 10bhp increase he claims.

As for the ecu, it is an adaptive system, that means it learns, it alters the base fuel map to compensate for these mods. The standard ecu is good for around 90 bhp. The fueling is not the problem, its the ignition, this is a fixed map and depending how far you go with the tuning mods will need adjusting, which as most know can only be done with a Superchips Icon pigy back ECU at £300. Not worth it TBVH.

The main reason the the magical 90bhp is difficult to break is because the ECU fueling uses Flow/density measuring of the air, which wild cams dont like.

Do the mods and the ECU will keep up but wont be perfect. Thats the bottom line.

cheers for the help, im starrting to thnk that its prob not the best idea to go for max power out of the spi unit, im will continuie the search for the enigne my want, i shud really stay with carb, but i wnt an injection engine, but the search shall go on!, also, has anyone but a 205 engine ???, also, wats the quickest 0 - 60 any1s had on teh 998?, i got myn to 12 secs the other day, give or take, a few milliseconds, to human error, and cud prob go lower lol , wb ste

[stellis]

ello, mini sprocket, hw much did your engine cost the a 1400, thngy , and what sort of power are you gettin out of it ?., cheers ste

[Sprocket]

You'll be lucky to find a set of 74mm (1399) pistons these days. Some pop up on ebay from time to time.

73.5mm (1380) pistons and rings £220
Fit pistons to rods £20
Crank polish(decent crank to start) and new bearings and thrusts £85
Over bore block £75
Skim Block £30
Oil Pump £25
Cam Shaft, Kent 274 injection cam £85
Stage two unported 35mm inlet valve head £250
Various miscelanious parts, gaskets, seals, timing chain, valve springs and so on roughly £100
injection LCB £85

More was spent rebuilding the box and a new clutch, so the figures do tend to rocket, you need to look at the whole picture not just the engine.

This engine when i had it on the rollers put out a tad under 80bhp at the flywheel with a non Cooper ECU, but this was only an initial figure, i have since fitted the correct exhaust link pipe, removed the cat, fitted a fully ported head, currently waiting on a fully ported inlet manifold, 1.5:1 ratio rockers and the fully programable ECU to finnish it off.

Im expecting 100bhp, remembering that the 274 cam is a pretty tame came in the range. May change the cam because the programable ECU will allow me to use Alpha-N air measurement instead of the Flow and density type of air measurement, as said, it is this that prevents injection engines running wild cams, not even the MG cam works.

I built the engine and comissioned the work my self at my local machine shop. Check the adds in the mags for engine kits

[stellis]

[ello, cheers, for your replhy, i mite try that, i have about 1500 for my new enigne so got a few options, i also have access to my own machine shop,m so ill prob be bck on wen i finally decide what i wnt, to help along with the build , cheers for all your help, ste :D:D:D