59 replies to this topic

[Slinky1313]

to be honest im a littel suprised how few people do it, it seemed like the natural progression for me lol, i like the idea of never having to change the suspension again and it updates it abit, i can understand if your trying to keep it original but it just seems like springs are the best option( in my opinion anyway).

[benmoffat]

All the talk here about coils seems to be coils springs that replace the original rubbers. And the problem with the springs becoming dislodged seems the be the main fear.

But what about coil over kits? No chance of dislodging there and you still have a set of coil springs and adjustable shocks.At about £400 a set.
I was thinking of using these, either Spax or Gaz. Zcars us them on their kits and was just wondering why no one has suggested them.

Or Slinky is there a reason you havent considered them?

Would love to hear you thoughts
Thanks.

[evansisgreat]

All the talk here about coils seems to be coils springs that replace the original rubbers. And the problem with the springs becoming dislodged seems the be the main fear.

But what about coil over kits? No chance of dislodging there and you still have a set of coil springs and adjustable shocks.At about £400 a set.
I was thinking of using these, either Spax or Gaz. Zcars us them on their kits and was just wondering why no one has suggested them.

Or Slinky is there a reason you havent considered them?

Would love to hear you thoughts
Thanks.

Coilovers are alot of work to put in. Where as the coil replacements are just that, a replacement for the cone, so they just go straight in. No more work that renewing a standard cone. Also don't forget to add on the price of the new brackets and screws etc (£62!)

Edited by evansisgreat, 25 January 2010 - 12:37 PM.

[chappy]

I knew I'd read it somewhere, see below (from Minispares website)

It has been said that one of the biggest improvements that can be made to a Mini is to replace the rubber cone springs. When that statement was made it referred to new rubber cones… there is now a new standard in Mini springing: coil springs! This direct-replacement kit includes everything to replace the harsh riding rubber cones with proper springs. Special hard anodized aluminum perches allow the springs to be fitted to either the stock trumpets or Hi-Los. The highest quality progressive winding is used to insure that the springs will not sag after many years of use, unlike the rubber cones. Available in three spring rates: C-SRP100 is soft (Blue), C-SRP200 is firm (Red), and C-SRP250 competition spec.We do not recommended these for road use as the spring can dislodge when hitting holes in bad roads especially lowered cars.Suspension mods should be carried out by proffessionals as in racing..

That bit about them falling out relates to the competition springs, its just that it's not worded very well on the website.

to be honest im a littel suprised how few people do it, it seemed like the natural progression for me lol, i like the idea of never having to change the suspension again and it updates it abit, i can understand if your trying to keep it original but it just seems like springs are the best option( in my opinion anyway).

You will have to change again eventually, they won't last forever, but they will last alot longer than the rubber doughnuts. All 'modern' cars have springs on the damper (coilover setup) and the springs have to be replaced every now and again, but obviously this is alot less frequent than traditional rubbers.


I'd go for the minitastic springs, fast road. you do get a little more body roll in the corners, but if you have your geometry set up well, it'll be fine. The reason for peoples springs falling out is due to using competition springs on the road.


I've got a contact for setting up tracking, Full geometry and corner balancing if your interested, send me a PM.

Sam

[maccers]

I have fitted the Mini Tastic fast road kit to my saloon and pickup. I had some problems with the saloon, as I ordered standard height Gaz dampers, but intended to lower the car. I've now replaced the Gaz wih lowered AGX type, have not had time to try them properly yet.

As for the springs though, they are very good, less harsh than the rubber springs, but still really fun. When you have the spring in your hand you will not be able to compress it, for those that are thinking about it, they are still really really stiff, but somehow give really comfy ride. Well worth it.

[Slinky1313]

All the talk here about coils seems to be coils springs that replace the original rubbers. And the problem with the springs becoming dislodged seems the be the main fear.

But what about coil over kits? No chance of dislodging there and you still have a set of coil springs and adjustable shocks.At about £400 a set.
I was thinking of using these, either Spax or Gaz. Zcars us them on their kits and was just wondering why no one has suggested them.

Or Slinky is there a reason you havent considered them?

Would love to hear you thoughts
Thanks.

Coilovers are alot of work to put in. Where as the coil replacements are just that, a replacement for the cone, so they just go straight in. No more work that renewing a standard cone. Also don't forget to add on the price of the new brackets and screws etc (£62!)

yeah i was lookin at them before aswell but like evan said i think its probrobly just abit more hastle all and all having to change the brackets just to even fit them on etc. plus i know im spendin nearly that much on the springs but it is a hell of alot lol

I knew I'd read it somewhere, see below (from Minispares website)

It has been said that one of the biggest improvements that can be made to a Mini is to replace the rubber cone springs. When that statement was made it referred to new rubber cones… there is now a new standard in Mini springing: coil springs! This direct-replacement kit includes everything to replace the harsh riding rubber cones with proper springs. Special hard anodized aluminum perches allow the springs to be fitted to either the stock trumpets or Hi-Los. The highest quality progressive winding is used to insure that the springs will not sag after many years of use, unlike the rubber cones. Available in three spring rates: C-SRP100 is soft (Blue), C-SRP200 is firm (Red), and C-SRP250 competition spec.We do not recommended these for road use as the spring can dislodge when hitting holes in bad roads especially lowered cars.Suspension mods should be carried out by proffessionals as in racing..

That bit about them falling out relates to the competition springs, its just that it's not worded very well on the website.

to be honest im a littel suprised how few people do it, it seemed like the natural progression for me lol, i like the idea of never having to change the suspension again and it updates it abit, i can understand if your trying to keep it original but it just seems like springs are the best option( in my opinion anyway).

You will have to change again eventually, they won't last forever, but they will last alot longer than the rubber doughnuts. All 'modern' cars have springs on the damper (coilover setup) and the springs have to be replaced every now and again, but obviously this is alot less frequent than traditional rubbers.


I'd go for the minitastic springs, fast road. you do get a little more body roll in the corners, but if you have your geometry set up well, it'll be fine. The reason for peoples springs falling out is due to using competition springs on the road.


I've got a contact for setting up tracking, Full geometry and corner balancing if your interested, send me a PM.

Sam

yeah i see what you mean, any idea what kind of lifespan im lookin at? because a new cone would last a good few years so i figured before the springs started to sag to the point where it was causing a problem would in all honesty probrobly be more than i own the car for lol, also i was talking to Yosuke from minitastic and he sent me a few diagrams (if anyones interested i can email them to you) explaining that apparently what happens alot of the time is people buy the springs but use the standard hi-low trumpets for the cones that dont have a high enough inside wall, so when you hit a bump or something the spring just bounces over it, where as their ones are machined especially for the springs with a higher inside wall. And yeah that sounds awsome if you dont mind, where are you based?

[mikkosan]

I found out a week ago that my rubber cones were collapsed already. I just had springs fitted yesterday. The comfort it provides is great. Although I did miss the feel, connection and the stiffness that I used to get with my rubber cones. I can't do sharp turns at 90kph anymore. The tyres squeal, the car drifts sideways and I can feel the body roll. Where I used to do it on rubber springs with ease.

I guess it's a small trade off for comfort. I'm quite happy with it. I just need to get used to it.

Also, mine sits quite high and the hi-lo screws are in the minimum setting. Would getting a lowered shock absorber do it for me? Thanks!

[chappy]

because a new cone would last a good few years

If your lucky, generally rubber cones are known to collapse after about 500 miles

. And yeah that sounds awsome if you dont mind, where are you based?

I'm based in Northampton


i'll send you a PM in a sec with his details...


for that matter, if anyone else wants the details, let me know


thanks

Sam

Edited by chappy, 26 January 2010 - 11:29 AM.

[Rich.]

Do the minitastic fast roads ones fit onto standard Hi-lo's?

Id want to fit a set but need to work out if i can just replace the rubbers and stick them ontop of the Hi-lo's, or do i need to take the Hi-lo's off aswell and stick the mini tastics own hight adjusters on?

Rich

[Udo]

Do the minitastic fast roads ones fit onto standard Hi-lo's?

Id want to fit a set but need to work out if i can just replace the rubbers and stick them ontop of the Hi-lo's, or do i need to take the Hi-lo's off aswell and stick the mini tastics own hight adjusters on?

Rich

Yes they fit standard hi-lo's - well mine did using the minispare red set up

[Boyee]

Just to keep this thread going...

Currently fitting P&Ls coils all round my mini at the mo - fast road/daily springs. As for adjustment, with the car jacked up and the arm suspended with dampers attached. Have you guys set the hi-los so that the springs are under compression already so that there is no movement or have you allowed for movement - without the danger of the set-up falling out under hollywood style jumps?

My hoping is to have the hi-los adjusted so that there is slight movement as i can't see when the arm will be at full travel at any point on a daily drive. Hoping my KYB Gas-a-justs will work well with these - don't want to splash any more money!

[bloke]

I found with the setup even under constant pressure, the front springs moved and slit sideways, so that when you hit a pothole or a speed bump it sounded like the world was coming to an end. I enquired here about the rubber spacers which were reasonable but the postage was £140 so I made my own out of woven silicone rubber composite material that I found at an army surplus place (it's used for tanks, so I thought it should stand up to a bit of Mini abuse) Anyway, so far, no more movement and the ride is silky smooth and quiet.

Just to note I do have the ride at standard, as the movement is greater than with standard cones, the roll is slightly more but the cornering ability is greater because the shocks (gaz adjustables) are now doing their job, (as opposed to the rubber cones doing some of the damping) and the grip is more controlable. If it is going to break out, it does it slowly instead of suddenly.

The Gas-a-justs were fine on my Mini but I wanted more damping so I upgraded to the Gaz shocks, which I have to say are miles better than Spax, which I have also owned.

Apart from that I would have to say it is a huge improvement over rubber cones if you want comfort, if you want to lower your Mini and are not too bothered about comfort, go for the sport coils, lowered Gaz and the bigger (or solid) front suspension limiter. This will help things stay where they should.

[Bugz]

I found with the setup even under constant pressure, the front springs moved and slit sideways, so that when you hit a pothole or a speed bump it sounded like the world was coming to an end. I enquired here about the rubber spacers which were reasonable but the postage was £140 so I made my own out of woven silicone rubber composite material that I found at an army surplus place (it's used for tanks, so I thought it should stand up to a bit of Mini abuse) Anyway, so far, no more movement and the ride is silky smooth and quiet.

Just to note I do have the ride at standard, as the movement is greater than with standard cones, the roll is slightly more but the cornering ability is greater because the shocks (gaz adjustables) are now doing their job, (as opposed to the rubber cones doing some of the damping) and the grip is more controlable. If it is going to break out, it does it slowly instead of suddenly.

The Gas-a-justs were fine on my Mini but I wanted more damping so I upgraded to the Gaz shocks, which I have to say are miles better than Spax, which I have also owned.

Apart from that I would have to say it is a huge improvement over rubber cones if you want comfort, if you want to lower your Mini and are not too bothered about comfort, go for the sport coils, lowered Gaz and the bigger (or solid) front suspension limiter. This will help things stay where they should.

 

 

Can you please post a picture of the upgrade you did on your springs (the silicone rubber). 

 

Also what kind of springs do you have and from where.

 

I was interested in the Minitastic ones (was first going for the town ride ones, however after reading a lot of posts on the fast road... started to change my mind).  I also purchased a set of standard height GAZ adjustable shocks.  Did you keep yours on middle setting?  I want a comfortable ride especially due to the numerous potholes and bumps on the streets of Malta.

 

and is the standard height too high?

 

 

Thanks a lot for your help.

[bloke]

 

Can you please post a picture of the upgrade you did on your springs (the silicone rubber). 

 

Also what kind of springs do you have and from where.

 

I was interested in the Minitastic ones (was first going for the town ride ones, however after reading a lot of posts on the fast road... started to change my mind).  I also purchased a set of standard height GAZ adjustable shocks.  Did you keep yours on middle setting?  I want a comfortable ride especially due to the numerous potholes and bumps on the streets of Malta.

 

and is the standard height too high?

 

 

Thanks a lot for your help.

 

Honestly, after a little while driving around with these, something wasn't right. On closer inspection the high low's had become dislodged again, and had all been severely distorted or bent. So I took them all out and replaced with fresh Dunlop rubber, and new high low's.

 

Sorry to be the bringer of bad news, but the suspension travel moves to rapidly causing things to move when they shouldn't, and if you tighten up the adjustable shock absorbers to slow things down, you are back to the state where you have a harsh ride again. 

 

I hope this helps, and saves you some heartache. It

[Cooperman]

For road use you will not beat the original rubber cone springs. The suspension was what originally set the Mini apart from other cars of that era. It was pure genius to not only make the springs from rubber, but to shape the rubber into a curved cone thus giving true rising-rate springs which automatically increased in rate as the cone was compressed. The more it compressed, the higher the spring rate becomes which is ideal.

It's a different requirement for racing where a high initial rate is better to reduce initial turn-in body roll when entering a corner on a totally smooth track. Other than that the best you could get with a coil spring is spring rates very close to the rubber cone spring rates.