31 replies to this topic

[Gulfclubby]

Just to make sure you're not making something wrong, pardon me if this is a stupid question. But upon changing the races, you did also change the tapered rings that have to be pressed into the hub, right? By pressing, he means you either need to do it with a press or with a hammer and a big nut and punch it in carefully and evenly until it is completely flush down at the lip in the hub. If you never changed those rings and only replaced the ball-bearing races, the bearing is always going to foul up rather quickly. And if the ring goes in very easily, it may turn when driving, causing friction at the shaft and play in the bearing. You'd likely have to replace the whole hub in this case.

Edited by Gulfclubby, 11 August 2011 - 11:48 AM.

[Notay]

Hi I had a similar problem and could feel the brake juddering when used. I found out that my driveshaft nut had come loose causing the collar washer that sits in the drive flange (which I think everyone is referring as a flat washer - but I may be wrong) was well worn. Went to Classic Mini bits in Bradford and got a replacement nut and collar washer. Luckily the bearings were fine.
And tightened everything back up to 190 lb/ft torque as recommended by Haynes for 8.4 disc setup and placed in a new split pin. car has been fine every since.
I was always told to 'torque up your nuts'.

[MRA]

Did you slide it in by hand or did it need "help" ? if it needed help then it should be ok....

The main issue is probably due to wear of the CV caused by the inner bearing parts, inner being the smaller part of each bearing that fits on the CV joint.... The reason for the flat washer is to pull it all home correctly.......

[dklawson]

Rover recomend the user of a large flat washer for a reason, some people will say don't use it, however I have never had one fail since using a flat washer.

I second that. What you are supposed to do is fit the new bearings, assemble the hub, fit the large (thick) flat washer WITHOUT the split, tapered ring, and torque everything up to spec at least once. Then you carefully remove the nut and flat washer, then fit the tapered washer, nut and torque to spec again. The purpose of the flat washer is to draw up all the play/clearance and fully seat the bearings. Failure to use the flat washer MAY allow the tapered spit washer to bind onto the CV shaft prematurely which leaves the assembly loose. This can damage the CV shaft fairly quickly.

Just to make sure you're not making something wrong, pardon me if this is a stupid question. But upon changing the races, you did also change the tapered rings that have to be pressed into the hub, right?

This is a point of semantics. The term bearing in this case is for a complete assembly (inner race, rollers, outer race). Those "tapered rings" are the outer race of the bearing. Yes, they need to be replaced when the bearings are renewed... that's why you get new ones as part of the bearing assembly. As others have said, all these parts are sold as matched assemblies (inner bearing, spacer tube (where applicable) and outer bearing). All the bearing parts need to be replaced at the same time.

[MRA]

which I think everyone is referring as a flat washer - but I may be wrong

Yes that is wrong.... the split cone washer is part of the assembly, the flat washer is a tool used to aid assembly

Edited by mra-minis.co.uk, 11 August 2011 - 12:15 PM.
spelling misstake :)

[Darkscamp]

Another classic case of attacking a mini supplier although its actually operator error.

The kits they buy are from the same as many other suppliers and i've personally never had an issue with them.

[Gulfclubby]

The outer race is what I mean then:) Bloody difficult to know all the part names in like 3 different languages:)

[Duncy H]

Rightio, thanks for all your help, it is much appreciated. I've stripped the corner down as much as i can but can't get the upper balljoint to release so i can get the hub off. Any tips to nip it off?

As described above the brake judders when it is loose, but that doesn't say a lot because it could do that with all sorts of different problems.

I did replace the outer race and not just the actual bearings themselves. The one i can see (outer) seems to be sitting quite nicely and not simply falling out so I guess that is one sign that a new hub may not be needed. I took off the drive flange and I can't see much in terms of wear. Here is a picture, I guess you guys and gals know what you are looking for better than me.



I don't have one of these flat washers you guys speak of, I guess not using it didn't help me in the first place, is there anything I can use as a substitute or is it a specific one needed?

So far it is pointing towards wear in the cv joint as mentioned above, is it pretty nailed on that if the race on the side of the cv in the hub is a loose fit then the cv is likely to need be replaced? I hope that makes sense

Edited by Duncy H, 11 August 2011 - 01:35 PM.

[MRA]

Can you add a photo of the CV.... the shaft part where the bearings fit, a couple of good photos at different angles would be useful

[Duncy H]

I will do once i can get it off, having trouble with the upper balljoint not giving in. It won't budge atm.

[Duncy H]

Rightio, I had a brainwave, well not really but a realsation. I had a second look at the castle nut and tapered washer. I mentioned before that the pin was getting ruined due to the castle nut sitting to far on to the thread and not getting enough contact with the pin and so with any force on the pin it would bend and then the wheel become wobbly. Well take a look at this photo.




I'm 99% that these are more than past it. If i got some new ones then sure when everything was re-assembled then it would sit higher and i wouldn't have this problem. On inspection if the bearing races etc there doesn't seem to be much in the way of movement so with my fingers crossed this could be a simple cheap fix. What do you guys and gals reckon???

[L400RAS]

In the photo of the split washer, are we looking at the face which makes contact with the castle nut? If so - this face should be completely flat - yours looks like it has a groove worn into this face? A lot of material seems to have been worn away. Replacement is definite, and castle nut for good measure.

[MRA]

Knackered it is but what about the CV joint ??

[Notay]

yep exactly what happened with me - the conical washer had worn just like yours and caused the castle nut to sit further back - because of that the split pin holes will not line up correctly when you tighten it up and as a result you have a tendency to loosen the castle nut so that it does line up - eventually causing the castle nut to come undone during use.
as above change the conical washer and the castle nut for good measure.

[Duncy H]

Got myself a new castle nut and tapered washer, there was no comparison whatsoever. Hopefully this will do the trick. If not I will bite the bullet and replace the lot. When i did inspect everything it all sempt in order and nothing made me raise an eyebrow. Sorted the bearings out too now so they match also.