9 replies to this topic

[olly33]

Hi I have had my car now just over a year,part resto.The car had been sat for 12 months,after a engine rebuild,and as far as I know,it has not been run in fully yet.I have been starting it occasionally to get the car back into the garage,but not been driven as yet.
The oil still looks fresh and clean,but unsure what type is in there.
I need to change the gear selector seal,so assume the oil will need to be dropped out anyway? What oil should I use for running it in(cannot say 100% if its run in or not),and whats the best way to do this?

Thanks for any advice in advance,I greatly appreciate your comments. Olly

Edited by olly33, 05 December 2014 - 10:12 PM.

[ANON]

http://www.mototuneu..._in_secrets.htm

[Spider]

Here's a sheet that I gave to customers (in the day);-

 

Engine Initial Start & Running In

 

Oil for Running In Period

 

Use Penrite Running In Oil. Do not subsitute.

 

Initial Engine Start

 

1)    Prime the Oil Pump (from the Banjo Bolt on the front of the engine).

2)    Be sure you have a GOOD Battery

3)    Test the Oil Switch on the engine. Disconnect the Black Wire between the distributor and Coil. Turn the key to RUN, the Oil Light should come ON. Disconnect the wire from the Oil Switch, it should go OFF.

 

DO NOT PROCEED UNTIL THIS WORKS 100% RELIABLY

 

3)    Fill with Fuel, Water and Oil etc. Do NOT fill with Coolant at this time, only clean tap water.

4)    Ensure Brakes etc are working

5)    Ensure the engine is dust free.Remove the spark plugs

6)    Crank the engine over (it will sound 'funny') until the Oil Light goes OFF. This may take anything from 30 secs to 15 minutes.

7)    Leave it sit for a Minute and check that the Oil Light comes back ON. Crank over again and check the Oil Light goes OFF, should only take ~ 5 - 10 seconds.

8)    Check for Oil Leaks. Resolve.

9)    Fit Spark Plugs and HT Leads, re-connect the wire from the Distributor to the coil.

10)    Be sure you have your Licence with you!

11)    Start and Drive it.

12)    Drive with gental accelleration until up to temperature.

 

for the first 20 minutes, keep the RPMs above 2000 RPM, then set it to 1100 RPM (run in period for Cam and / or followers).

 

DO NOT EXCEED THE FOLLOWING SPEEDS;-

 

1ST    20 KPH

2ND    40 KPH

3RD    60 KPH

4TH    80 KPH   

 

(Basically limiting to 3000 RPM Max - which incidentally is what the factory also recommend - see attached)

 

13)    When up to temp (about 1 - 2 minutes), on a quiet road, drive up to 50 KPH, Then in 4th Gear, accellerate HARD from 50 KPH to 80 KPH.

Do this 3 times NO MORE. Don't let the engine 'Ping'.

 

14)    Return to Base and check over. Resolve any issues and Leave overnight.

15)    Re-tension the Cylinder Head (50 ft/lbs or as recommended by the stud supplier) and Re-set the Tappets (0.012")

16)    Drive around locally, observing your limited speeds, for around 200 km.

17)    If all is OK, continue driving for 1000 km in total.

18)    Change Oil and Filter. Re-tension Cylinder Head and Re-set Tappets.

19)    It's now run in.

20)    Set idle to 650 RPM, check Ignition Timing and Carb Mixture.

21)    Check for leaks, noises etc.

 

GOLDEN RULES while running in;-

 

DO NOT accellerate hard - ever

DO NOT Over-rev it (observe above limited speeds) - ever

Don't let it over-heat

Avoid Idling, up to 30 seconds is OK, but don't let it go on any longer. After you've done about 600 km, it will be OK to idle for longer periods, but still try to avoid it.

Avoid sitting on the one speed. It will be OK for a minute or so, but keep the revs changing.

Drive 'normally'

Don't ever let the engine 'Ping'

 

After Running In Period

 

Re-check Cylinder Head Tension

Re-set Tappets

Change Oil and Filter. Recommended Oil Penrite HPR30.

Drain Cooling System (ensure heater is set to HOT), flush with clean water, drain and then fill with Coolant. Castrol have a good one. Do not use Tecalloy.

[olly33]

Thanks,a good read.Was the classic mini engine not done in the old style honing process?,I thought he was referring to cars being built nowadays.

So, as I know he had it on a dyno, thats probably the running in sorted.Just need some fresh oil 20w/40? and a new filter I guess.

[myredmini]

20w50 not 40

[Guess-Works.com]

As always there are two schools of thoughts of running in engines...

 

I personally believe that an engine is 'run-in' within the first 20 minutes/hour of running... and by taking it 'gently' after that time can actually damage the engine.

[Cooperman]

Many schools of thought on this. I used to follow, more or less, the method shown by Moke Spider above. Then many years ago I had to fit a just-built all-new engine on the day before a major rally. It was a Mk.1 Escort Mexico, but the principle is the same. We started it at about 5-00 pm when the rally started at 10-00 pm about 100 miles away. We started it, ran it for about 20 minutes, road tested it for around 15 miles, took it back and changed oil & filter, re-torqued the head, then had dinner, drove to the start and did the event.

It ran perfectly and we finished in the top 3 (from memory). We never re-built the engine for the rest of the season and the car/engine did many more tough events. When we did a precautionary re-build about 12 months (new shells, rings and valves, etc) later the engine was in fine condition and didn't really need a re-build at all.

So really I don't know how important it all is. Maybe we make too much fuss about running in. Maybe just take it a bit easy for the first couple of hours running and change oil and filters then. Others may have had bad experiences with failing to fully 'run-in'.

As for oil, I just use Castrol 20w50 mineral for running in a Mini, then Valvoline VR1 20w50 for normal running.

[ANON]

i've never minced around running an engine in and never cranked an engine over just to get oil pressure up and never had a problem with an engine i've built. 

 

have got an engine on my bench at the mo that's going in a clio next week once it's built back up, will be running about 300bhp and will be started straight away, no messing around with it, then after it's ran up to temp will be trailered up to rolling road for run in and mapping. 20 minutes max for the run in and the guy running it in runs a 1000bhp renault 5 turbo.

 

plenty of graphogen on crank/bearings, fill crank with oil, oil feeds to cams filled with oil and job's a good 'un. 

[olly33]

So,after intial warming up period,I guess the best practice is to hammer it,well not quite,but no need to be "Driving miss daisy".
As its been on a dyno,can we say that the engines probably ran in by now,and I can go for 20w/50 non mineral oil? Cheers guys.

Think I was back at 17 in my first mini using 10W/40,Ha ha.

[Spider]

From the Bore and Ring view point, how to and how long it will take, largley depends on the honing process of the bore and the type of rings fitted, some examples above.

 

I had a 'fresh' engine bought to me a few years back and the owner was instructed to 'drive it like he stole it', it ran like no tomorrow, but only lasted 4000 km before it smoked pretty bad (oil smoke), he was pretty disappointed as it was his every other day daily driver. It appeared that the bore was finished on the course side and it was fitted with soft rings (you could almost tie them in knots), Nippon if I recall. It was very evident that this combination was used for a quick run in period but conversly it's life was limited from the day it was taken off the honing machine. This is how a Race Engine might be done so quick seal could be achived at the expense of engine life, which usually doesn't matter as in a season, it'll likely do less than 1000 km.

 

Much of the running in is done in the first 25 - 30 minutes, I recall Mahle did a study on this a little while back, however they also went on to say that it shouldn't be loaded up for at least 800 km and that complete running in wasn't achieved until around the 5000 km mark. Certainly the engines I've done with Chrome Rings this is very much the case.

 

Interestingly, car manufacturers to this day, more or less subsribe to the method I posted ^ and keep in mind these guys not only have their extended warranties to protect, but their reputations too. I remember about 20 years back, Mitsubishi (at least locally) said that the cars didn't need a run in period at all. The cars did go OK until about the 80 000 km mark after which 2 out of 3 were burning Oil. Not a good look.

 

I've always noted that a fast run in = fast run out.

 

One engine (1275 fitted to a Moke) I did back in 89 - 90 for a customer is still on the go today with over 300 000 km on the clock, it does use some oil these days, but doesn't need topping between changes. This one of course has Chrome Rings and I know the owner did follow those instructions.

 

On the other hand, 'babying' them is equally bad news, hence drive them 'normally' some period of load (not full load!) followed by a period of light load. This not only keeps temps at the ring interface from getting out of hand, but also the pistons, rings and bores all change shape with load and speed, so it's important that the rings and bores seal at all these varying shapes.

 

I'll just finish this post by suggesting that if you've had your engine rebuilt by a 'professional' engine reconditioner, be sure they provide instructions on how to start it and how to run it in and follow their instructions to the letter. At least that way, if a problem should occur, at least you haven't done anything to void your warrenty.

Edited by Moke Spider, 06 December 2014 - 08:16 PM.