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Has The Electric Car Bubble Burst?


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#1 mab01uk

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Posted 12 February 2023 - 11:39 AM

"Eighteen-month waits after order your new car and seemingly unending queues to power it up due to a dearth of new charging stations being built. This seems to be the experience for many UK motorists when buying and owning an electric car.
And this may be why a recent recovery in the new car market - after registrations fell to an 40-year low last year - is being partly fuelled most significantly by a surge in petrol car sales and less-so by electric cars like Teslas.
New statistics released by the Society of Motor Manufacturers and Traders (SMMT) showed new car registrations saw a significant boost this January compared to the same time last year.
Britons may be becoming switched off to the idea of battery-powered electric cars due to a lack of public charging stations, which can leave drivers queueing for hours waiting for a point to free up.
Electric car infrastructure in the UK was considered at 'crisis point' after it was revealed last month that just 806 new chargers were being installed per month, This is Money reported.
This rate which needs to nearly quadruple to 3,130 installations a month to meet the Government's target of having 300,000 devices nationwide by 2030 - when the UK will ban new petrol and diesel cars. There are only 37,055 charging points in the UK as of January this year.
And new SMMT data shows that the rollout of charging infrastructure is still 'failing to keep pace', which is 'challenging consumer confidence'.
In the final quarter of last year, just one public chargepoint was installed per 62 plug-in cars, a fall from 1:42 compared to the same quarter in 2021.
Overall in 2022, just one standard public charger was built for every 53 new plug-ins registered, the weakest ratio since 2020.
According to the latest figures, there is only around one public electric charging point per 30 plug-in vehicles. This includes the 680,994 battery electric vehicles and 458,875 plug-in hybrids."
https://www.thisismo...l-vehicles.html

 



#2 IronmanG

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Posted 12 February 2023 - 11:58 AM

I've been waiting 12 months for my van. In that time the cost of electric has certainly made it less attractive.

#3 sonikk4

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Posted 12 February 2023 - 12:40 PM

We are supposed to be getting EV’s Airside at Heathrow soon. However after i conducted some interviews two weeks ago, one of the applicants who is a Honda Engineer raised a potential sticking point.

When an EV goes up in smoke especially a Lithium battery powered type, the only true way to fully extinguish the vehicle when the battery pack is burning is to submerge it in water. The whole vehicle. So large tanks of water will be needed to push the vehicle into.

Food for thought!!

#4 DeadSquare

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Posted 12 February 2023 - 03:34 PM

If all the Internal Combustion vehicles  were to be changed to Electric Vehicles in the present ULEZ, apparently less than 10% could be fully charged at any one time.

 

So what, said Sadist Khan, I need polluting vehicles to raise money, that's why I'm expanding the area.



#5 PoolGuy

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Posted 12 February 2023 - 04:05 PM

When an EV goes up in smoke especially a Lithium battery powered type, the only true way to fully extinguish the vehicle when the battery pack is burning is to submerge it in water. The whole vehicle. So large tanks of water will be needed to push the vehicle into.

What about the massive fire blankets that are being used?



#6 Homersimpson

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Posted 12 February 2023 - 05:20 PM

We are supposed to be getting EV’s Airside at Heathrow soon. However after i conducted some interviews two weeks ago, one of the applicants who is a Honda Engineer raised a potential sticking point.

When an EV goes up in smoke especially a Lithium battery powered type, the only true way to fully extinguish the vehicle when the battery pack is burning is to submerge it in water. The whole vehicle. So large tanks of water will be needed to push the vehicle into.

Food for thought!!

I'm working on a project to upgrade our EV charging provision at work, one of the things we have is a list of requirements and guidance from our insurers on where they can be positioned to reduce risk.

 

I think EV's are relativly safe at the moment (from a fire perspective) because they are all quite new and maintained mostly be main dealers/specalists.  I can see this changing as they get older and the backstreet garages and car dealers start to get hold of them and bodge them up for sale.



#7 KTS

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Posted 12 February 2023 - 05:21 PM

hmm. 

 

according to the figures quoted;

 

"Petrol cars saw the largest growth in new car registrations compared with last year, with 58,973 being registered this January compared to 51,468 at the same time last year - a rise of 7,505.

 

But new battery electric vehicles saw a smaller growth in new car registrations compared to last January rising by 2,861 from 14,433  last year to 17,294 this year."

 

that gives an increase on last years figures of 14.6% for petrol cars and 19.8% for electric vehicles. Put another way; growth in new car registrations for electric vehicles was 35.6% higher than petrol cars in the period...



#8 humph

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Posted 12 February 2023 - 06:46 PM

hmm. 

 

according to the figures quoted;

 

"Petrol cars saw the largest growth in new car registrations compared with last year, with 58,973 being registered this January compared to 51,468 at the same time last year - a rise of 7,505.

 

But new battery electric vehicles saw a smaller growth in new car registrations compared to last January rising by 2,861 from 14,433  last year to 17,294 this year."

 

that gives an increase on last years figures of 14.6% for petrol cars and 19.8% for electric vehicles. Put another way; growth in new car registrations for electric vehicles was 35.6% higher than petrol cars in the period...

Typically ill informed mainstream media article about electric cars.  Headline and tone suggest one narrative, but the figures quoted tell a different story. As KTS points out in his post above.  The article itself states “BEVs only saw a limited growth in market share this January compared to the same time last year - rising from 12.5 per cent to 13.1 per cent. Petrol cars did not see any growth in market share remaining at 44.7 per cent”. The big oil lobby has gone into overdrive to pedal the EV misinformation recently, but as a household that is completely BEV, except our Minis, we’ve had nothing but a positive experience. All our charging is done at home at 10p/kwh (£7.50 for 280-300 miles), and that is true of the vast majority of EV owners.



#9 bpirie1000

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Posted 12 February 2023 - 07:45 PM

Seen 4 this last week at the side of the road with no electric. The roadside break down companies can now not assist like they used to.....

More now a case of lift and shift....

Can not even tow them away...

But yes..... this appears to be the future.....

#10 imack

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Posted 12 February 2023 - 08:13 PM

We have some customers who love their EV and others that say it was a terrible purchase and the wish they'd bought the petrol version. We had lots of complaints about poor range when we had sub zero temperatures. Customers don't seem to understand that low temperature, heated seats, high cabin temperature, A/C and any other electrical load will significantly reduce their potential range.
And then there's the van owners, down to around 40 mile range in sub zero temperatures when fully laden and all electrical goodies turned on!

Edited by imack, 12 February 2023 - 08:20 PM.


#11 Ethel

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Posted 12 February 2023 - 08:22 PM

Pretty sure RAC vans are equipped with chargers. Still only gives a few miles of charge to, hopefully, get to a charging point. Expect they are still happy to have a service to sell though.

 

A drop in sales isn't surprising really. They ain't cheap, so there's a still a big chunk of the new car market they aren't in. Those with the readies to tap in to the reduced running costs will have done it & the interest rate hike'll have made it a whole load harder/ less attractive for those that buy on finance. Then they'll still be a few years off making a noticeable dent in the used car market - an extra hurdle for making charging infrastructure scalable .

 

They need the sums to add up for the fleet (leasing) market  & the infrastructure still isn't there for many. Chicken 'n egg

 

 

Edit: Guess that should read a drop in the rate of increase in sales  :errr:



#12 sonikk4

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Posted 12 February 2023 - 08:41 PM

 

When an EV goes up in smoke especially a Lithium battery powered type, the only true way to fully extinguish the vehicle when the battery pack is burning is to submerge it in water. The whole vehicle. So large tanks of water will be needed to push the vehicle into.

What about the massive fire blankets that are being used?

 

 

This was mentioned as well and to be honest the answer was still fully immerse in water. So we shall see what happens when the trigger is pulled and the infrastructure Airside can cope with everyone trying to charge their vehicles. I have no doubt there will be some serious risk assesments being written as a lot of these vehicles will in very close proximity to £200 million Aircraft.

 

I know what happens when Lithium battries decide to go Poof on a Aircraft (i'm talking Aircraft batteries here) and now all 787 batteries are encased in a sealed metal box.



#13 unburntfuelinthemorning

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Posted 12 February 2023 - 10:19 PM

Thirty minutes to charge up an electric vehicle on a fast charger compared to three minutes to fill up a petrol/diesel car.  If there's two people in front at the charger/pumps that becomes nineties minutes against nine minutes.  

 

My ten year old Focus still gets about the same MPG as it did when new.  If battery electric cars are anything like my laptop after ten years I'll need a very long lead to keep it permanently plugged in.

 

I can see these things going the way of the Betamax cassette and the Sony minidisc.



#14 Lowestoftmodder

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Posted 12 February 2023 - 10:38 PM

Thirty minutes to charge up an electric vehicle on a fast charger compared to three minutes to fill up a petrol/diesel car.  If there's two people in front at the charger/pumps that becomes nineties minutes against nine minutes.  
 
My ten year old Focus still gets about the same MPG as it did when new.  If battery electric cars are anything like my laptop after ten years I'll need a very long lead to keep it permanently plugged in.
 
I can see these things going the way of the Betamax cassette and the Sony minidisc.


I completely agree that we are still in the Betamax stages with electric cars.. hopefully a better solution is on the horizon?

#15 mab01uk

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Posted 12 February 2023 - 11:08 PM

JCB: Building a Hydrogen Future

 

Toyota FINALLY Revealed New HYDROGEN Combustion Engine


Edited by mab01uk, 12 February 2023 - 11:11 PM.





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