72 replies to this topic

[The Matt]

.god knows what they went through.

dashboard, bulkhead and engine by all accounts.

Sorry, but what a tasteless comment to make! I'm not sure I agree with posting pictures of fatal crashes on the site anyway, friends/family of the driver may be able to read this thread!

[biggav]

The picture i posted has been used in national press campaign's for speeding, drink driving etc. the familes of victims have given their permission for the pics to be used and i currently have a presentation that we give to year 11 at school (the last opportunity to get everyone before they go out into the big wide world.)

The emphasis of my attitude towards car crashes is that i am pig sick of them. If i felt sympathy for the victims or their families i would not be able to do my job effectivley (post traumatic stress etc). Empathy would better describe how i deal with it. The effect of loosing someone close to you is the same regardless of the cause but the human mind tries to reason out how and why things happen. The innocent person dead in the car is no more dead than anyone killed in the burma cyclone or china earth quake, we just relate to it better because it's in this country and in a car we recognise. 10 people die on the roads every day. 10 yesterday, 10 tommorow and 10 today. the number of people killed and seriously (by which i mean left in a coma, missing limbs/use of limbs and needing help fot the rest of their lives) injured would equate to a 747 crashing every week. in each case, families are devastated and lives changed forever. Until you experience loss of one type or another, you won't relate to it as much has someone who has.

When threads like this appear, you will only usually hear about "i walked away from this without a scratch" or "look at this write off" followed by a picture of a car with a wing or boot damage. Very easy to paint a one sided picture of how safe a mini is. The dead can't speak for themselves and i know lots of people who shudder at the sight of a mini due to loosing a loved one in a crash involving one.

I appreciate that my comments appear to go against the grain but my whole intention is to prevent situations like the one pictured from occuring again. no one is unbreakable.

[MiniDick]

I've got nothing but respect for you doing such a job mate. My nephews best friend was in his Mini (somewhere in Cannock) when a Landrover Discovery doing about 50 with a bull-bar T-boned him. Completely destroyed the Mini and he was left with brain injuries and speech problems and as far as Iknow is still learning to walk again. All we can do is drive as safely and responsibly as we can, there's nothing you can really do about other road user's actions. I think if you were in any small car in that photo I think you'd be dead, that's one massive smash. After my nephews mate's smash my family and my brother especially starting slagging off Minis big-style, but like I said, ANY car which gets hit side on by a Landrover with a metal bull-bar doing 50mph will be destroyed and there's a good chance you'll either be a vegetable or dead.

[Lund]

I want a rollcage

[BoboGib]

To be honest The Matt, I agree with Gav. My line of work has seen me in some pretty bad situations doing things i would like to forget. But you learn to deal with it differently than most people as if you don't, you end up making yourself ill.

[Ethel]

To be honest The Matt, I agree with Gav. My line of work has seen me in some pretty bad situations doing things i would like to forget. But you learn to deal with it differently than most people as if you don't, you end up making yourself ill.

Yeah, well said Gav and the relatives of that Mini's driver have my respect too. A life is a life and can be easily lost, we have a rather perverse view of mortality in the developed world. If the wreckage from all those fatal road accidents was left by the roadside instead us having the likes of Gav tidy it away so as not to offend our sanitized view of the world we might have a different set of expectations and a better respect for all life.

[BoyracerAU]

Has anyone actually gone into how the NCAP rating works?

I've heard it's the reason why a lot of new cars have these low shovel nosed fronts on them. The idea is that they are pedestrian friendly. The shovel nosed front will flip a pedestrian over the car instead of ploughing into them. This whole business apparently gives them a higher rating NCAP-wise.

And, of course it also gives you a low fronted car that scrapes on speed humps and low driveways.

[A KIRK]

Your just as likely to die in a mini as you are in any modern car, all these ratings etc only really affect the cars are lowish impact speeds, crash a car doing 100mph regardless of what you drive your not going to come away looking very pretty.


If I worried about what car I drive for saftey reasons, I'd never drive.

[biggav]

I completley respect matts point of view and the fact that this debate has been allowed to run without being closed. It's also important to note that it is not my intention to cause personal upset by any of my comments just to try and add balance to what could be a very one sided argument.

Ncap tests are carried out in controlled conditions to set criteria (speed, angle and target). it is therefore possible for manufacturers to design cars to react favourably in those conditions, ie side and front impact. pedestrian safety tests are again carried out at set criteria and therefore will only offer results based on what they are tested on.

Going back to what A Kirk said, there is a vid done by fifth gear with a smart car going head on into a concrete block here
they did a test at 70mph, higher than Ncap test and the car behaves very well and the door still opens.

The most important point of the vid is from 5 minutes onwards.

[miniman.matt]

please dont offended by his comments im in the army and as with other public services we have to block out the stark reallity with a strange sort of humour in order to perform very difficult jobs, i can understand the shock value of this sort of picture to you guys, but i feel it serves as the best warning for people to drive a lot more carefully and think before they do anything stupid.

[Juju]

Thanks to Gav for posting this.

Regardless of the safety rating of your car, motorcycle, push bike or legs, you can never anticipate the behaviour of others on the road, and some accidents you just can not prevent.

Don't let these "unknowns" make you fearful of doing the things in life that make you feel good. Our western society is becoming paranoid about safety because we are (fortunately) no longer exposed to the risks that we used to have to face. Enjoy your little cars, enjoy your cycling & watch out for others but make the most of the very finite amount of time that you have on this planet.

[photographymatt]

I know this is offtopic to the original post but I lost my best friend last july in a carcrash. An old man was out driving to his local fishing spot at 5am, my friend was coming home from work. Police report says the old guy went onto the other side of the road and hit my friend. Sadly both were killed, as I would liked to talk with the old man:-( Im of the opinion...once your a certain age...stop driving, your as dangerous as drunk.

by the way friend had an escort, not sure what the other man had. In a proper crash...nothing going to help you. The ncap tests are low(ish) speed I thought? Buying a higher Ncap rated car will give you piece of mind but I have noticed it gives some a feeling of invincabilty.

I drive defensivly, I assume everyone on the road is a moron who will turn into me at any moment.

[sidq]

all of em are undoubtedly horrifying but as much as safety is concerned, the way you drive is the most essential part of all this.doesnt matter what u drive but if u leave a good and safe way of driving at home every time u want to go driving u r one step closer to cost someone's life and ur own.

[mini-geek]

i think pics should be shown of thing like this maby if the guy in the other car had seen a pic like that just befor he got in the car he wouldnt of drove like a *male chicken* and killed some one

people drive like cocks in this country not just young people older people too sadly people die every day in car crashes it seems wrong because it is if people just thought about how they drove could affect others aswell as them selfs


can i also make a point to the people who say a mini is safer because it can avoid accedents because it can handel no melonsing chance your more likly to panik and lock up your brakes and still hit the thing you were avoiding

[jayare]

I am firmly of the opinion that people who drive 'safe' cars are some of the most dangerous drivers on the road these days. It seems that the 5-star Euro-NCAP rating makes people feel invincible - if there was a big sharp spike in the middle of everyone's steering wheel rather than an airbag or six, they would take much more care over their driving as they would know that a crash (however slight) would most likely end in them dying.

It's sobering seeing the photo posted by Biggav - I know I couldn't cope with seeing scenes like that and applaud him and all the other people to whom these sort of scenes are too often part of their working lives. The fact that the car is a Mini doesn't really mean that much though - most cars and their occupants would most likely have suffered a similar fate with the closing speed that it must have taken to cause that sort of damage to a car. My thoughts are with the family of the innocent driver.

JR