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Marilyn The Mistress - Austin Mini

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#31 StefanPieter

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Posted 13 December 2014 - 11:14 PM

I am looking for someone advise. After finding more rot I am comparing body panel prices and found that the genuine panels are more than double the price of a non-genuine panel.

Is it worth buying the genuine? What really is the difference?

#32 Ben_O

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Posted 14 December 2014 - 05:35 AM

The difference is in the tooling used to press the panels.

 

The main Pattern panel manufacturers are Hadrian and Magnum and it depends on what panels you need to decide where to get them from.

 

Some pattern panels are ok quality and can be fitted with out any problems whereas others barely resemble the panel they are supposed to replace. You will also find that some pattern panels are designed as repair panels and are made to fit over the top of existing panels so fitting them any other way is not really possible as i have found recently.

 

M-Machine are highly recommended as they manufacturer some of their own key panels and the fit and quality are both very good.

 

Thing is though, even Genuine Heritage panels are not as great as they were originally as the tooling used to press them is worn but they are generally the best fitting panels available.

 

If you want to put up a list of the panels you need to buy, i can recommend which ones are worth getting genuine and which ones can be bought non genuine.

 

Hope this helps

 

Ben



#33 MINIMADrt

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Posted 14 December 2014 - 10:07 AM

"Thing is though, even Genuine Heritage panels are not as great as they were originally as the tooling used to press them is worn but they are generally the best fitting panels available."

 

​totally agree well described ben



#34 StefanPieter

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Posted 15 December 2014 - 09:55 PM

Update... Not a happy one at that.

 

After chipping away at the right side oversills and I discovered some more and I mean bad repairs. It seems like the inner sill was quite rusted and rather than fixing the inner sill it was patched from the inside with a plate and an oversill from the outside. To top it all of tar based tar insulation was put over it hide the bad job and make the fix 20X harder. End or rant... 

 

Now for some pics

 

Inside

iVbRNQt.jpg

 

7ggPPrW.jpg

 

Repair panel

Bc1LpYC.jpg

 

Floor/Seat box

ZK5AKyx.jpg

 

 

Back floor

9Pak9lq.jpg

 

3LqL38x.jpg

 

 

 

The difference is in the tooling used to press the panels.

 

The main Pattern panel manufacturers are Hadrian and Magnum and it depends on what panels you need to decide where to get them from.

 

Some pattern panels are ok quality and can be fitted with out any problems whereas others barely resemble the panel they are supposed to replace. You will also find that some pattern panels are designed as repair panels and are made to fit over the top of existing panels so fitting them any other way is not really possible as i have found recently.

 

M-Machine are highly recommended as they manufacturer some of their own key panels and the fit and quality are both very good.

 

Thing is though, even Genuine Heritage panels are not as great as they were originally as the tooling used to press them is worn but they are generally the best fitting panels available.

 

If you want to put up a list of the panels you need to buy, i can recommend which ones are worth getting genuine and which ones can be bought non genuine.

 

Hope this helps

 

Ben

 

Thank you for all the assistance Ben

 

Following my new discoveries I have made a list of panel I suspect I need for both left and right side of the car. Feel free to chip in if you think I need something in addition to this list.

 

  1. No. 8 Outer sill 4" 6 flutes
  2. No.16 Sill panel and floor to first groove. Is it worth buying the panels separately as this assembly is very expensive?
  3. No. 21 Heel board subframe repair. I am considering making this as it looks straight forward.
  4. No. 25 Radius arm shroud?
  5. No. 32 Stiffener for inner sill to body?

Any advise how to best go about cutting this out for the best fit of new panels?

 

kT9KTz8.gif

 

I hope to post something more positive in the near future. The lady is getting cut up far too much for my liking at the moment.



#35 bluemini17

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Posted 15 December 2014 - 10:44 PM

some daunting findings you have there Stefan. Keep on chipping away and you will soon be rust free.

 

Try and concentrate on one 'panel area' at a time. Taking all the rust out in one go can become very daunting.

 

Keep up the good work, another one saved :xmas:



#36 StefanPieter

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Posted 15 December 2014 - 10:58 PM

some daunting findings you have there Stefan. Keep on chipping away and you will soon be rust free.
 
Try and concentrate on one 'panel area' at a time. Taking all the rust out in one go can become very daunting.
 
Keep up the good work, another one saved :xmas:

Thank you for the encouragement. When I first started to poke around at her I never expected to find such nests of hidden rust.

That said she is a keeper so it's good to know it's done right while having some fun.

The biggest challenge for me at the moment is to understand how she fits together in order to know what to buy to be able to repair her. The diagrams only take you so far.

Thank you to everyone for the support and advice. Every bit helps.

Edited by StefanPieter, 15 December 2014 - 11:01 PM.


#37 Ben_O

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Posted 16 December 2014 - 01:40 PM

  1. No. 8 Outer sill 4" 6 flutes
  2. No.16 Sill panel and floor to first groove. Is it worth buying the panels separately as this assembly is very expensive?
  3. No. 21 Heel board subframe repair. I am considering making this as it looks straight forward.
  4. No. 25 Radius arm shroud?
  5. No. 32 Stiffener for inner sill to body?

 

Outer sill - I would go genuine as the fit and finish is much better

 

Sill panel to first groove - M-machine do their own one which i have just used on mine, very cheap and a very good fit too

 

Heelboard repair - Be carefull when buying non genuine as the concealed nuts for the subframe bolts are not welded fully and may cause you problems with them  breaking free of the mounts and then just spinning.

Heritage do half heelboard sections for not alot of money.

 

Radius arm shroud - Only the very early Mini's had tese so no need for one on yours

 

Stiffener from inner sill to body - I am not aware if an aftermarket one exists but they are quite straightforward to make if you want to do that

 

These are just my opinions.

 

Some people swear by the inner sill/outer sill assembly complete as it can save time but personally i can't justify the extra expense. That really is up to you.



#38 StefanPieter

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Posted 29 December 2014 - 10:18 PM

Thank you for the advise Ben. M-machine seems to be much cheaper.

 

I did a bit of a comparison table:

 

Discruption MiniSpares vs M-machine
Sill to First Groove Assembly, Complete, LH, Mk3-5                                                   195.00 vs 81.00
Sill to First Groove Assembly, Complete, RH, Mk3-5                                                   195.00 vs 81.00
Sill, LH, Mk3-4 Genuine                                                                                                39.56 vs 22.80
Sill, RH, Mk3-5 Genuine                                                                                                39.56 vs 22.80
End Repair, Rear Sub Frame Mounting Panel including bracket, LH Genuine                           16.50
End Repair, Rear Sub Frame Mounting Panel including bracket, RH Genuine                           16.50
SUBFRAME MOUNTING REAR PANEL WITH LOCATION POINTS                           70.68 vs 54.00

 

Update...

 

Managed to remove the RH patch panels on the sills and found some more rot. The frighting things is that the patch they put on was over the drain hole and the plug was missing. One cheap patch causing an expensive fix once again.

 

Inside of the car:

WYqdGAq.jpg

 

Outside foot well:

5rrg0CE.jpg

 

Outside RH sill:

aiF2PkY.jpg


Edited by StefanPieter, 29 December 2014 - 10:28 PM.


#39 StefanPieter

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Posted 01 January 2015 - 10:01 PM

There was an injection of enthusiasm into the project today as I picked up a gearbox from samt88 which he put on the freebie section. Thank you Sam.

 

Here are some pics

 

FUtX6gq.jpg

 

LXTMdfz.jpg

 

T5svvgL.jpg

 

xMyrEvV.jpg

 

TUKAwvd.jpg

 

The plan is to refurbish the gearbox as part of an engine rebuild some time in the future.



#40 StefanPieter

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Posted 11 January 2015 - 08:14 PM

A bit of an update...

 

I managed to spend some time on Molly today in preparation for the panel repairs planned. I managed to get the rear subframe off with not too much effort. The brake pipe was seized so I had to chop it. As I wanted to remove the subframe with the sock absorbers I needed to remove the fuel tank. I found that the boot was filled with fibre glass! The restoration 15 years ago stated by the previous owner must of been more of a botch job that the body shop told him.

 

Sorry for the bad quality photos

 

The subframe is bent so it will need to be replaced... Damage indicated in pink

 

XKXTkyc.jpg

 

 

 

While I was removing the subframe I noticed a few holes in the area. I'll upload pics in the upcoming days...

 

Once area of concern was what I wound at the A Panel! The A Panel was only held together to the chassis by one spot weld which I indicated in pink. The panel is loose all along the yellow line and there was a triangular hole at the bottom filled with seam sealer which is indicated in blue. 

 

 

QGD9uPN.jpg

 

At this point I am not sure if this is correct? Is this another botch job and will need replacing? By looking at various assembly diagrams the A Panel and the hinge panel should be welded together. See in orange below.

 

RIKkNrP.png

 

HELP...


Edited by StefanPieter, 11 January 2015 - 08:21 PM.


#41 StefanPieter

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Posted 28 February 2015 - 10:15 PM

A bit of an date...

 

After discovering many many bits of metal rot in the floors I got myself in gear and bought a MIG welder in preparation for during my own welding. I decided to get the R-Tech i-MIG 180 and some hoddy gas. To date it has been a great piece of equipment and has delivered great result.

 

aOU3o1S.jpg

 

 

So after practising and some more practising I gained confidence in my welding ability. So this said, I started shopping around for all the panels I needed to fix the lady and it was at this point I was astonished how much it was going to cost. More that £500...

 

But I might have a easier way to do this... here is a hint of the direction I am planning to go with.

 

7T9thJM.png?1



#42 Stu.

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Posted 28 February 2015 - 11:29 PM

I'd think twice about that idea. It'd be almost impossible to cut the panels out that you need from the donor shell and retain the nesessary flanges and seams you'd need to weld them into your shell. You'd also be very lucky to be cutting out corrosion free panels. If your shopping list for replacement panels is £500 I'd say you've done well.

#43 Ben_O

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Posted 02 March 2015 - 12:24 AM

I'd think twice about that idea. It'd be almost impossible to cut the panels out that you need from the donor shell and retain the nesessary flanges and seams you'd need to weld them into your shell. You'd also be very lucky to be cutting out corrosion free panels. If your shopping list for replacement panels is £500 I'd say you've done well.

It is possible ( I did it) but very very time consuming. i would hesitate to do it again or recommend it and you are right about the corrosion stuff.

 

Ben



#44 StefanPieter

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Posted 03 March 2015 - 05:48 AM

Thank you for the advice guys. In that case I might swop out the shells and go for a full restoration.

I will post some photos of the shell when I get a chance.

#45 Stu.

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Posted 03 March 2015 - 08:09 AM

If by 'swop out' you mean re-shelling using another one, you might want to visit DVLA's web site and have a look at the rules regarding vehicle registration. You could do a re-shell, however you would be required to re-register the car, and would not be allowed to retain the re-shelled car under its existing V5c log book. The log book would need to be surrendered, and the car may well be registered on a Q plate, or possibly an age related plate.





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