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Engine/ Rocker Clicking - New-Ish 1380!

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#31 Midas Mk1

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Posted 07 June 2016 - 08:24 PM

Took the rad off tonight and timing cover plate, expecting that the belt may have somehow slipped, but everything's on tight as we fitted / checked it.

 

13419008_10206209305662820_7827684588485

Need to check with the dti next, apart from that, anything else left to check before the inevitable?


Edited by Midas Mk1, 07 June 2016 - 08:38 PM.


#32 Midas Mk1

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Posted 08 June 2016 - 07:10 PM

Dial gauge.

Ac

 

Used a dial gauge tonight, and below are the results (excuse my handwriting)

 

O_O Can' tell if this is good/bad?

 

13394123_10206215595460061_3591797782176



#33 Allrounder

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Posted 08 June 2016 - 08:25 PM

Watching the video there seems to be movement between the head and exhaust which would mean there is a tight spot as the exhaust valve is either near full lift or closing (providing the spark plugs aren't in but can't see).
So if your sure there no valve springs binding then id look at the valve timing. On your last post are they figures for valve lift at tdc or maxium valve lift.

#34 Midas Mk1

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Posted 08 June 2016 - 08:53 PM

Thanks for the reply! Figures were at full lift, just fitted all the rocker shims we have (4.5mm) and thought we'd sorted it for a second, but when adjusted down to 19thou it's still clicking.

 http://vid907.photob...zpssabrhc3z.mp4


Edited by Midas Mk1, 08 June 2016 - 09:28 PM.


#35 ACDodd

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Posted 08 June 2016 - 09:29 PM

Something's wrong, you have a 0.009" variation on lift. Either your method is very suspect or your lobes are flat! New cams would only vary by 0.002" at the most.

Ac

#36 Midas Mk1

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Posted 09 June 2016 - 11:28 AM

Something's wrong, you have a 0.009" variation on lift. Either your method is very suspect or your lobes are flat! New cams would only vary by 0.002" at the most.

Ac

Thanks AC, I'll do a repeat test tonight to make sure everything was correct.

 

As for the valve springs on compression, they weren't binding, even though it sounds and feels like a spring load 'ping'. 

 

If the cam was flat, surely I would have noticed a gradual drop off in performance? Literally drove it home from the rollers having been told it was bang on, (drove amazingly good), then did oil change, valve clearances set, then tried to drive again, and its where im at now. During both initial and last oil change, there was no unsual swarf or anything in the oil, which confuses me some what (+ great oil pressure). The only thing is, that it sounded tappety at the dyno on idle with 16thou clearances, but I put this down to the titan roller rockers? 

 

Sounds daft but if the heads been skimmed, block been skimmed too, could the pushrods be too long, even with 4.5mm pedestal shims?.

Im convinced the pinging noise is coming from the exhaust valve side. 

 

Thanks everyone for the help so far, much appreciated, determined to get to the bottom of this! 

 

13277791_1546005555709035_377753183_n.jp


Edited by Midas Mk1, 09 June 2016 - 11:46 AM.


#37 podifold

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Posted 09 June 2016 - 12:21 PM

Sam, here's the reply I put on your Instagram post:

 

 

Looks like you've got shims under the rocker post and it looks like it's over towards the exhaust valve side. Check it isn't catching the spring. Mine were and I had to grind the edges of a few of the shims to get them to clear.

 



#38 Midas Mk1

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Posted 09 June 2016 - 06:52 PM

Thanks for replies! :) just been to check the shims and a couple were pretty tight against the springs. Relieved them so that they fit better, still the same clicking :(

I'm really struggling to believe it's the cam, surely there would have been a gradual drop off in performance, and swarf in the oil?

#39 Midas Mk1

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Posted 09 June 2016 - 07:07 PM

Timing is fine too, valves are open when the pistons are away from the head.. Confused

 

Took the fuel pump off, looked fine, and managed to grab a pic inside.

 

I know the blocks been skimmed, and the head is 20.2cc so quite abit taken off, so I'm thinking next step is to try add more than the current 4mm rocker shims?

Is there a way of calculating the perfect shim size for the rockers? Sorry for more questions, just got this feeling this issues something stupidly simple..

 

13355614_1752601901654992_1561109955_n.j


Edited by Midas Mk1, 09 June 2016 - 07:59 PM.


#40 monkey

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Posted 10 June 2016 - 06:40 AM

So I'm gonna start but saying my knowledge is minimal and I have no idea what's causing your clicking, but I do have a question or two, plus you get a free bump :-P

Did you say you can hear the noise when turning over by hand?
If so, how often does the noise occur? Once every crank revolution? Once every 8 revolutions?
I assume you have tried the old screwdriver to the ear trick to try to narrow down where the clicking is coming from?

#41 Midas Mk1

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Posted 11 June 2016 - 06:44 PM

Just an update! Spent this morning triple checking shimming of the rockers, still no change, but when holding the pushrods you can feel the click / clunk lower down.

Should have the engine out in the morning and will post pics of the result, although rather worryingly and confusing, 20 mile old millers is now dark blue tinted? Some tiny pieces of brass/copper, only minor minor pieces though, grains of sand if that sized

Also, with the fuel pump off, you can feel the click along the camshaft too! :(
Appreciate all the help and replies guys! Trying not to get too stressed about with all this

Edited by Midas Mk1, 11 June 2016 - 06:47 PM.


#42 Midas Mk1

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Posted 12 June 2016 - 06:49 PM

What a day!

 

Firstly thanks for all the replies & advice!  

 

Got the engine out, flywheel and transfer casing off. Went to take the timing belt off, and first of all was greeted by this.. >_<

 

756A5BD4-DEEC-4ED4-8107-A55AC6E490F1_zps
 

http://vid907.photob...zps27qouyze.mp4

 

 

 

Total slack in the belt drive, remind me never to believe something is professionally built. Couldn't actually believe the slack in it! Think I might have finally got to the issue!! 

 

http://vid907.photob...zps27qouyze.mp4

 

 

 

Split the engine & box, does this polished wear on the cam lobes look normal? 

 

 

 

Sam

 

AADB4479-3E70-4AD7-B8C4-B754D205F199_zps


Edited by Midas Mk1, 12 June 2016 - 06:50 PM.


#43 absx2

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Posted 12 June 2016 - 07:55 PM

Bugger!. I had something similar on a chaps mini with a rattle at tick over and just above. The noise was instantly noticeable as coming from the timing area so I checked the water pump and alternator bearings by hand. Then gave the bottom pulley a shake and it was loose as hell with a chewed up keyway as the woodruff key was just jangling around in there.

He was happy to go away and tighten the bolt himself with a new lock washer even though I told him his cam timing could easily be up to 10 degrees out.



#44 59 Speed

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Posted 12 June 2016 - 08:19 PM

At least it didn't go completely when it was running, that would have been catastrophic!

 

I'd get a vernier and a good quality IWIS chain on there instead.

 

And get a new oil pump in there while your at it.

 

Good work.



#45 Allrounder

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Posted 12 June 2016 - 10:56 PM

Bet that's a relief that you got to the bottom of it, even more so that you found it before it caused too much damage. Surprised with all that slack it didn't give you odd results when checking the cam timing though.





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